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| Author | Amend mercenary and commanders guild experience tables |
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Over the summer I got bored, and in a work avoidance measure I looked at what order is optimal to level up your guilds (ie which gives the highest stat gain for the least number of battles). If anyone is interested in this I can see about making it public or something as I cannot easily put the outcome into the forum due to formatting.
Obviously we all know that hunters guild is best to level first, but cannot simply stick to hunting all the time and hope to be balanced and competitive.
Within this I knew that MG and CG reach a point when you think meh, this is a lot of effort and the reward is a long wat off. What I hadn;t realised is if you look beyond this the reward in terms of stats doesn;t make sense really.
So here are some numbers to clarify
In MG to get +1 stat you first need to get to MG2 - this is 120 points
For another you need MG4 which needs a further 480
For another you need MG6 which needs a further 900
For another you need MG8 which needs a further 1500
ok so all in a pattern, big jumps but ok I can understand that
However for a further +1 stat you next need MG9- an extra 1000, 500 less than was previously required and not far off what was needed to get from MG4-6 for just your 3rd stat advance from MG.
It is a similar picture in CG
first stat is from CG 2 for 350 points
next stat is from CG 4 needing an extra 1050, a big jump
then however you get another from CG5 for an extra 800
To me this is demotivating in levelling CG past level 2 as the benefit character wise is just so distant, similarly for MG from 4 to 6 and 6 to 8. It is perhaps unsuprising then that you get people that often camp at these levels and just don;t bother with it anymore.
Surely it would make more sense to change the point increments needed and get a stat every level and so have a more even level of character development and progression. | | CG 2 to CG 4 is 2 levels for 1050. You want them to rearrange the points required considering stat bonuses only? Then it would make sense to remove all the guild levels that do not give stats. I think the game is designed so that each guild has some meaning beyond that and stats are meant to be bonuses. | Yes, totally agree.
I remember checking long ago the MG Table thing, and I thought "Lol Wth?, its not even worth it" (Sorry for Vulgarity Btw).
Im struggling A LOT to even get MG 6, my God. But a mayority of people have it, so I have to get MG 6...
I bet if you put the different Guilds in a graphic (I dont know if its the correct word), and check the behaviour of the line pattern thing, you can see that the line is not steep at all.
To me this is demotivating, unsuprising then that you get people that often camp at these levels and just don;t bother with it anymore.
Still, I fear this is against the "Local Rules", and if Admins were to ever read this, they wouldnt do, since 7. Do not start topics with suggestions to alter the formulas for gaining experience/skill points. | for virtual_vitrea:
You want them to rearrange the points required considering stat bonuses only?
Not only by stats, I am fine with there being increments without a stat bonus such that they can deliver other bonuses either through different elements to loot, or looting an art in PvP etc.
However, I do think that as you level in a guild there should be a stats reward for the character that is proportional to the effort required to reach it that gets higher, rather than in these cases lower. There is a large limbo land between CG 2and 4 where you gain nothing in between that helps your character win (perhaps ave gold from looting arts but not improve anything in battle, thereby removing a level of differentiation of players based upon achievement). With this particular gap on average the win rate of CG will be 50% (some will be higher and some lower), this is an awful lot of battles and with the taking longer a lot of time too. Kudos to those that have achieved it. The 250 less points needed to get the next advance one could perceive as a reward for that long and sustained effort, but I feel a more incremental development would be fairer and more motivating.
for Ipsen: I believe that rule relates to the formula for gaining exp and FSP rather than what each level is banded at, though as you say the liklihood of anyone with any power to effect a change should they agree is very very low. Still I am bored and just felt like saying stuff TBH. | I don't understand you. Clearly you are using stat rewards to evaluate effort-reward relationship instead of looking at guild progress fairly.
So here are some numbers to clarify
In MG to get +1 stat you first need to get to MG2 - this is 120 points
For another you need MG4 which needs a further 480
For another you need MG6 which needs a further 900
For another you need MG8 which needs a further 1500
ok so all in a pattern, big jumps but ok I can understand that
However for a further +1 stat you next need MG9- an extra 1000, 500 less than was previously required and not far off what was needed to get from MG4-6 for just your 3rd stat advance from MG.
Its easier to get to MG8 even at my combat level, but as you get to mg9 and higher the quests will get much harder so i see it as a fair case of efforts being rewarded with a stat per level beyond that point. The alternative to this is to have similar increment in required guild points (what you call pattern), but then it will be actually impossible to progress enough to get that reward without more army strength and combat levels.
About CG, i don't even know what to say. Ideally, it is a guild meant to be played when the character has attained competitive stats through progress in other guilds. Personally, I think it is the guild where you actually get to showoff your character strength instead of being another way to develop a character. | | CG 3 reward is fine I think... but getting to MG8 feels like crawling through a swamp :P It helps a bit to play with non-main faction, so you get some fsp on the side and as 'side-reward' some anti-faction resistance | Just for some comparison
There is only 419 people who have CG 4
6059 with MG 8
yet already 2563 people with watchers guild level 4
This just doesn't seem fair to the investment those people have put into CG and MG, I feel they deserve more of a reward. This would also act as an incentive to those guilds, which is better for those that like pvp as well. | CG 3 reward is fine I think
It looks good on the paper, but it's a different thing in practice. It would be OK if it was leveled arts... Instead I loot some level 9 magic hat and whatnot because in PvE it gives random arts, not wathever the PvE hero is/should be wearing to have the stats it has (you can loot magic arts against pure might AI hero). And drop rate is like 5%. I got that because I like PvP, not for the reward. +2 durability of looted PvP arts is better though it can still be looting the magic hat of the level 9 hero or the level 19 sword that I'll just drop.
Also WG is much more popular because it's still the best guild, it pays for arts and give you lots of stats, best fsp and armaments. The disparity goes beyond just stats points. The way how it's done means there are "good guilds" to level up and "bad ones" so you end up feeling forced to do battles of some guilds for the stats/fsp to stay competitive rather than for the enjoyment of the battle.
I certainly think that dusting out the level tables would help (remember that the HG one is like 10 years old when CG, MG, AG and many HG and MG quests and changes didn't exist back then) at this point or reworking them a bit to make some of the worst guilds more appealing.
About CG, i don't even know what to say. Ideally, it is a guild meant to be played when the character has attained competitive stats through progress in other guilds. Personally, I think it is the guild where you actually get to showoff your character strength instead of being another way to develop a character.
It's all about point of view. To me it's the "enough of PvE" guild. I already fought enough battles to be able to estimate the virtual lenght. | Haha ok wizard hats don't really sound that tempting, I thought it would give at least own lvl arts.
And to think of it, the ratio of exp / parameters gained is horrible in CG, so it would make sense to give a little better rewards from the guild, now it just punishes character development. And I don't see any good reason to discourage PvP. |
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