| Author | 40th Minor tournament ++ result and Balance discussion |
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finally the exhausting mt++ go to an end, we can check the result here: https://www.lordswm.com/tournaments_hist.php?tour=357
and the balance statistic here: http://lgnd.ru/mt40/balance/lvl/18
(you can switch to the level you feel interested)
the balance I discussed later are all focused to combat level 18:
for lv 18, how to cut the dwarf is what everyone concerns. I would suggest cutting down the shooter count a bit, while no change to the talent and melee units. the problem of dwarf comes from dwarf shooters, which is slow, endurance, but low damage dealt in before, and this is what they are designed to be. but the piercing luck talent overcome the problem of low damage, which make the shooters omni.
in detail, I suggest dwarf lv 18 have spearman -15, patriarch -2 (both to the max count and overall count).
for bw wiz lv18, the problem is easy, just cut down some units averaged like what they are doing before.
for holy knight, the weakness of them come from their mechanism but not unit counts, keep increasing unit counts like they did before is not a right way. I suggest that give them a talent "divine barrier": units gain 12% magic resistance for each holy effect on them, this talent lies under dominion of protection.
but the best solution way is to release magic guild lv5 and give divine revenge to hero!
the low winning rate of charmer elf is just because of too many dwarf and bw wiz, nothing need to be done to them (though I believe they will be buffed significantly and dominate the next tournament)
tamer de, this guy really need a buff, I would suggest mistress +2 dragon +1, more dragon to make them more aggressive, and no more minotaur which may lead to invincible for some counters.
tribal: hard day for them, the new dwarf and unholy make them lost the only two favor counters, and the overpower of bw wiz killed the last hope of them. but when dwarf and bw wiz get fixed, they will not lead such a hard life.
new unholy necro: I think it is quite strong but ok, people are still not getting used to them, both themselves and their opponents. things will turn clear when people get the right way of playing and countering them. |
| tribal: hard day for them love this line |
| In level 15, two knights won 100% of the battles. Both were faction level 12 (of course)I found that only one tribal was among their opponents- and he was an absolute noob- took attack parameters and shooters. One faced a dwarf with piercing luck- and that fellow played badly enough. Neither of them faced a proper tribal/ dark magic barb or battle wiz. Apparently the gold is possible if you are incredibly luck in the choice of your opponents. |
for Greyfalcon:
yes, to be strong will grant you 90% win, and only luck can grant you the last 10%. |
| The dwarves topped the list of 100% wins in level 15- 5 or 6 of them- so it is reasonable to assume that they are the strongest at this level. |
The dwarves ... are the strongest at this level (15).
I agree. Its the only faction with mor than 60% winning rate in total: http://lgnd.ru/mt40/balance/lvl/15 |
new unholy necro: I think it is quite strong but ok, people are still not getting used to them, both themselves and their opponents. things will turn clear when people get the right way of playing and countering them.
I think there is a problem in balance for UNs (let's talk about CLs 14+). The most of players go pure might build for UN with few points in knowledge, some use tactics talents so you can have 3 stacks of liches. Then you just dive to enemy and possibly get another strike before some enemy's units even move. Of course, this strategy can work but doesn't have to. Some opponents really can't do anything to win against such UN (whatever pumped they are), some can kill UN too fast before UN can raise.
Other possible builds (some hybrid with new talents) don't look very dangerous, it is again only a matter of your opponent. While it would work against some (and the result of combat is clear since the beginning), it can be sure loss against others.
I would maybe suggest to do some compromise between old UN racial ability and the new one. Something like push raised stack forward by 25% or 30% + 3%*fsl and push hero too by the same (or bit different). No need to do anything with raised HP. This could force UNs to go more hybrid builds including new nature talents too (I guess). Currently when you imagine your hero has 11.5 ini and expert sorcery, you are simply not fast enough to cast new spells and raise too, it is not very effective. UN's hero is almost the most important part of whole UN's army and need more speed in cost of less army ATB push after raise. I would maybe make it 20%+3%*fsl hero push after any nature spell (not only raise, but no for darkness magic). |
for Nowar:
the suicidal build is not overpowered right now, but yes, I agree that it lacks "interacting" between players so it should not be a good recommended build. I appreciate your idea that give the "super sorcery" back and make it not only applied to raise dead but to all nature spells, then the balance can be rebuilt by adjusting troop counts. |
I think the pendulum has swung back to attack/ luck now. I expected the barbarians to do well- but they haven't been all that successful. Necro and Knights have the lowest percentages of victories-44 and 47% . Dwarves are apparently strongest across all levels upwards of 14 till 18 (doesn't matter after that, as everyone has too high faction resistance beyond that). Tamer elf and dark barbs are the next best ones.
Accordingly, I hope that knights and necrosis are buffed. Necros were buffed recently. Either it has been ineffective or nobody has discovered a good strategy to go along with it. Knights had received a minor guardian ability a long time ago- too little in my opinion- and works specifically at the fag end of the battle. Holy knight is virtually dead for PvP. Perhaps they should allow dispersion and anti-magic to take out the correct spells only (dark spells for friendly units and buffs for unfriendlies). |
| The problem of the new unholy IMO is that it favors offensive playstyle but lacks range and unlike old unholy the hero is too slow to keep up in raising speed. |
| What means that percentile? I am in top 10 from 283 players and got only silver achievement. :( |
UN is very variable - many people are working out the best universal balanced build rather than specialists at one type of army.
Critical to this are the liche upgrade - it is the raise of two stacks of these that gives UN potency I believe and the resultant movement buff generated.
Use this correctly with luck triggers and they can do some significant damage very quickly and gain the upper hand.
Kill these quickly, or if they do not have enough and they will struggle (this is at least my experience in facing them, not in playing with them)
This will create a significant divide for those levels that have these upgrades available or not - DU level for this will give a big big buff - perhaps more so than any other DU level I think |
I expected the barbarians to do well- but they haven't been all that successful.
except on lvl17 dark barbs got 70% win rate, with over 50% against all factions (admittedly classic barb got 20% rate on the other hand, but i don't think any serious pvp players picked classic for this tourney, they would know it's weak) |
for Pastak:
I wondered how they would do this beforehand and I am not sure if they have done it as per what they said.
I thought it would be that the percentile is only based on those that get an award from completing the tournament - ie those with 15 wins. The total number of competitors does not affect this.
So in your case with elf there were 93 people that completed 15 battles, so 9 people equates to the top 10% However they have awarded only 4 people a gold(1 with no losses and 3 with 1 loss), while there are 4 with 2 losses. In total then there are 8 people who had 0,1 or 2 losses which equates to a number less than 10% of the people who got 15 wins, and therefore should be within the top 10%, however half of them did not get golds.....
If it is based upon the total number of competitors then with 283 people fighting as elves then 28 would get golds - I think this is too many.
If you look at CL10 demons https://www.lordswm.com/tournaments_hist.php?tour=357&tid=5449&race=7
then there is a weird balance here.
The only thing I can think of is if they constrain it to top 10 percentile and not lower than 2 losses or something like that as it does not seem consistent to me |
for IComeInPeace:
Have you seen CL16 for barbs - I think they did very well here
https://www.lordswm.com/tournaments_hist.php?tour=357&tid=5455&race=5 |
Great stats anyway. On my lvl (16) are dark barbs the best faction for duels by far. They have all faction over 50% and total win rate is 70%, wow!
The second are dwarves with 59% total win rate and DD 58%, no surprise. |
Thinking a bit more on the stats thing, I think I have worked it out.
Whoever gets the highest win rate sets the benchmark - ie that is considered 100% - those who get 90% of this value will also get gold - irrespective of how many people this ends up being.
In practice therefore whatever the top record is, those with one less win than this will also get gold. If someone has 0 losses for your CL and faction then gold will be for 0 losses and 1 loss. If the best result is 1 loss for your CL and Faction then you will get gold for 1 loss or 2 losses.
I don;t like this interpretation particularly(if I am correct but it seems to fit the data), and think it should be based upon the number of people entering - but hey ho. |
for Lord MilesTeg:
this is correct.
sometimes one guy who is strong and lucky got 100% win for some weak faction, thus ruined all medals of that faction. |
| Basically you get gold if your win ratio is >= than 0.9*(win ratio of best player). Between 0.8 and 0.9 for silver. If The best player has score 15/17, then you can have gold if your win ratio is >= 0.9*15/17=79.41% |
Critical to this are the liche upgrade - it is the raise of two stacks of these that gives UN potency I believe and the resultant movement buff generated.
Use this correctly with luck triggers and they can do some significant damage very quickly and gain the upper hand.
Lich isn't the end all be all, raise is weak (about 300 HP), it is impossible to protect large shooter (only knight and classic necro has no tool to kill them before they get their turn) and a lot can happen in beetween two lich turns...
Overall win rate is about 34% which says a lot. |
