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| Author | Top players (voice from a dark elf) |
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I know this may well become a flame war, but before claiming anything, let's put some data on the table.
Here is the faction distribution in top 25 players
Elf 7 (28%)
Dark Elf 1 (4%)
Knight 3 (12%)
Demon 3 (12%)
Wizard 2 (8%)
Barbarian 3 (12%)
Necromancer 6 (24%)
and here is in top 100 players
Elf 28 (28%)
Dark Elf 8 (8%)
Knight 17 (17%)
Demon 9 (9%)
Wizard 9 (9%)
Barbarian 12 (12%)
Necromancer 17 (17%)
You see the pattern? Despite the fact that darkelf has 14% population among all players, the ratio in top 25 players is way lower than other factions, and lowest in top 100 players.
Now other factions may have different opinions, but the facts are dark elf is weak in higher levels. I think the major reasons are:
1. no decent range attackers. forget about bandits. poisoners are next to nothing in higher level combats (because number is so low)
2. useful talents cost too much points for dark elf. fortune takes 9, leadership takes 10, erudition 10, chaos 9.
And I do not really expect that this post will change something, just complaints and ranting. Instead I do regret that I made a wrong choice in the beginning, and now it's too late to change. | | Dark elf are weakest faction, every experienced player know this... | +2
Especially on levels 8 and higher... :( | Interesting xinhua. I made the same statistics a while ago, underlining that Elves were too present on high levels.
I was a Dark Elf but switched to Elf faction: if you can't beat them, join them :) But I hope to get back to Dark Elf in the future - and keep my Elf faction levels as a protection...
But in the Grand Scheme of Things, I know understand that it's more complicated. For a start, playing Elves was far harder that I thought. In battles, by turn 2, all your bowmen are dead and your druids have no spell points left.
I firmly believe that every faction shine at a given level. From my point of view:
- At level 1-2, Dark Elves rule thanks to Earthen Spikes spell and their high-damage unit.
- At level 3-4, Elves are kings thanks to Elven Bowmen.
- At level 5-7, Necromancers have the upper hand, simply because they now have Skeleton Bowmen and you have to kill each of their stack three times in order to win.
It's not because a faction rule at a given level than others are doomed. For example, at level 5 Elves are a close second thanks to their Druids. But things evolve.
Druids, for example, become less and less effective at each new level simply because the damage dealt by lightning bolts does not increases by 9 with each new Druid in the stack and not 20. You start lacking space to make all these Druids stacks... And the number of enemy troops to destroy increases too.
Now, take Necromancers. Will they rule forever? I doubt it. They get Skeleton bowmen at level 5, but their further upgrades are awful. Plague zombies, anyone? Even the Ghost upgrade at level 10 is uninteresting at all, since it increases the HP of each ghost (so fewer ghosts are resurrected.)
Heroeswm.com is quite young and we only have a handful of level 8 players. The .ru is older and as it seems, Wizards rule at high level (Mechanical Golems with unlimited retaliations and that can be repaired, Genies, mini-artifacts...)
So the question is: is there a level where Dark Elves rule again? I can't tell for sure. But hordes of Shrews are not something to ignore. I've met interesting Dark Elves builds with plenty of Spell Power bonus artifacts and Elemental Call talent and believe me, they dealt impressive damage.
The only drawback I see with Dark Elves is that their faction level has no real use in the game. It's even worse than Barbarians. | is there a level where Dark Elves rule again?
No. At least not at 8-13 levels. | LOL Solmyr2000, you really seem to have a final opinion on this.
I just hope you are wrong :) | I haven't been a dark elf, but sometimes I was defeated by them. For example, shrews have high attack damage and rate, but at same time relatively low defense and hit points...
Anyway, I was surprised to see the small number of dark elf among 25 players. If it continues to happen in future, I am afraid new players will always choose other factions. | LOL Solmyr2000, you really seem to have a final opinion on this.
I am dark elf-10 on .ru and I seen ENOUGH to know, what happening with dark elves :(
Tournaments showed this.
Dark elf-mages does not exist there because everybody defeat them (maybe bad-playing knight or elf can be defeated), and they are first target at the groups after elf... Dark elf-warriors just a kamikaze - all based on luck/morale in first turn :) | | So i poked around the top 25 list on the RU server and found 6 Dark Elves on the top 25, and 18 in the top 100 so maybe Solmyr2000 can tell us how they got there? | | Can you tell if they have been Dark Elves all the time? Perhaps they switched lately. Check some of them if they have other faction levels here and there. | who cares about how good they are, dark elves have the coolness factor far above all others,
it is actually not the critters you (we) have that are bad, the numbers are just a bit short, and i think the problem is actually that every faction has a way to increase critter count for a specific tier except for the dark elves
the first couple of lvl's you do not miss this increase, but at lvl 6 at about, it starts to count.
so an upgrade/ building at lvl 6 or so that adds 2 lizzies or so would go a long way of compensating this (or 2 mino's).
a lvl 2 upgrade to add bandits/ rogues is to soon
a lvl 10 upgrade (like wizzards) is to late | oh, and i agree on the fact that the dark elf faction skill is the worst of all available.
it has no use on hunts due to only golems and unicorns have a magic shield/ proof
it has no use to almost all enemies except for barbarians, piercing non existant resistance has not really an effect.
i would say, make it like a wizards luck/ favored enemy version, depending on faction skill you can do double dmge with spells/ double effect on debuffs etc. | 12
Agree with what Mirz said, Perhaps a 30% per Faction Level spell damage bouus to neutrals compared to Wizard's 50% per Faction level, or 5% per Faction Level chance for spells to do double damage.
Currently a spell power 10 wizard with faction skill 8 could do close to 500 damage with every lightning strike to 90% of monsters in hunt and quests, While a similiarly Faction skill 8 DE with 10 spell power could only do 120 damage. Tis a disgrace to the name of old HoMM Warlocks! :)
Currently Dark Elves have a very hard time making it in the top hunter list in level 5, 6, and 7. | anyway, even if they do not do that well, I still like dark elves.
must be due to that i also play dark elves in Warhammer Fantasy table top games and this is very alike on units.
it is the versatility in the units that makes it a fun faction for me | | Not so sure about the top players, but DE is pretty strong in lvl 2 and 3 | | LOL you are right engsigh!!! But how much time people spend being level 2 or 3? Two weeks, maybe... | | as i sayed before - top shows nothing, ok u can tell hu are insane on this game by playng day and night to get to the top, ok u can say which faction little easyer to level up, but its all. I not played DE a lot but i know much of them, i know what its hard time for DE on 3-5 level and its hard like hell if u do not have sherws on 6-7 level, but if u do its uberfaction! on 6-7 level even necro whit 6lvl racial skill has no chanses against DE becous he is to slow and he cant retaliate to shews so rise ability do not work, maby they are few but i seen them at tourament they are strong enought! | 12 & 13 agree 100%. HoMM has both magic piercing and elemental chains (damage bonus to spells and creatures), so it evens out with the rest of the abilities. But here since elemental chains is not here the racial skill is next to useless. Atleast if they added magic resistance arts it might be of more use.
17: yes the initiative is an advantage over necros but what about elves who also paid to upgrade their units? or wizards? or orcs? all with ranged creatures that could reduce your shrews before they get to do serious damage. | Dark Elfs seriously need some kind of nurf
if not this then they need an additional racial bonus or something of an addition or change because Dark Elfs are way too weak in comparison to every other faction | | 19, so you say nerf the dark elfs, but then you talk about buffing them, you confuse me 0.0, but yes, dark elfes do need a buff |
This topic is long since last update and considered obsolete for further discussions.
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