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| Author | clan entrance fee a present or not? |
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all clans demand a fee to join them.
is this fee considered a present? | Yup, if it represents more than 30% of your wealth.
It is especially important if you wish joining a military clan, whose entrance fee is above 5 000 gold. | | sa basicly if u dont have more then 30 k if enterence is 10 k u cant even join military clan ? | | You got it right. The problem occured when clans were militarized, they were complaints about it. New members of Warrior's Guild Wrath had to be expelled and refunded because of the limitation (entrance fee is 16k) | aah ok. thanks, PetitEMechant, for answering.
do you perhaps know if that refund you speak of in #4 was necessary or 'just' good behaviour..?
reason for asking: i violated the 30%-rule when i payed to join a clan (not on purpose, i was just unaware it applies to joining-fees too) and i got expelled.. WITHOUT a refund... :( | and i suddenly realize...
if i don't get a refund, i'm still in violation..
hmm.
suggestions, anyone? | It was necessary because of the amount, the number of people and pressure from other war clans. Reaction before admin step in.
In your case, I guess it is one of the reason.
Another reason is the 10k "present" from Buny which was probably considered as cheating and transfer between mults. Limusdotcom quote it as the main reason.
Cheer up, 10k is just 2-3 days of enrolling. | (and as long as no one complaints, you risk nothing.)
Just earn lot of money to go beyond the 30% line. | | yeah true | [q] Cheer up, 10k is just 2-3 days of enrolling. [/q]
:) i know.. not losing any sleep on this whatsoever. but the principle behind it is still interesting..
[q] Another reason is the 10k "present" from Buny which was probably considered as cheating and transfer between mults. Limusdotcom quote it as the main reason. [/q]
this present was legit, as far as i know.. Buny had +200k gold at that moment.. as for mults, i can understand the suspicion, but this isn't the case. stoter is my main and only char. also, i'm playing from Holland, Buny from the UK (i guess this can be checked from our IP-adressess?).
where did Limusdotcom quote his reason? i could not find it..
[q] (and as long as no one complaints, you risk nothing.) [/q]
someone complained. the moderator asked me how it was possible for me to join the clan. i stayed honest and explained, and that's how i and some others got kicked out. | 2 parts to my post:
First from a "Juries" point of view. Regardless of links between this character and buny, the payments to join LoS were illegal and should have been refunded.
Looking at Limustudotcom's transfer logs I see that this has already been done to all 3 characters involved:
03-16-10 17:00: Transferred 10000 Gold to Lodevick : 10k #153 return. Buny friend, should not of trusted her. My mistake :)
03-16-10 16:59: Transferred 10000 Gold to stoter : 10k #153 return. Buny friend, should not of trusted her. My mistake :)
03-16-10 16:59: Transferred 10000 Gold to Aladdin007 : 10k return. Buny friend, should not of trusted her. My mistake :)
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Secondly to give some background to this. As most people are aware LoS take cheating vrey seriously and will not condone it within our clan at all.
These people (and a few others) were originally allowed into the clan before our standard checks were carried out (not common practice but slipped through on this occaision as they were recommended by who we thought was a trusted clan member).
When they were investigated, it came to light that 3 of them had made illegal applications and their transfers broke the 30% rule.
In addition it was discovered that buny IS in fact an un-listed multi of the Basion / Basion2 / etc cheating ring which recently meritted many character blocks and large fines.
These characters are all also closely linked with this ring of cheating accounts and may or may not in fact be the same person. Either way because of this, the illegal transfers, etc none of them are welcome in LoS and hopefully will be dealt with more fully when Arctic has time. | Actually, not that 10k is a lot of money, we turn down a lot of applicants in LoS. In fact, 100% of outsiders that wish to join, are inspected pretty well before an invitation is even sent out, or funds received to join. This weeds out 90% of cheaters right from the get-go.
A more thorough investigation is done after they join IF it is warranted--ie we start to see suspicious activities days/weeks/months after they join us. Then a full blown investigation is done, many hours will be dedicated to this 10% pool...and then evictions are done here for those that manage to slip past the cracks.
Up until today, for over 1.5 years that I have run LoS, NEVER has an accepted member recommended to pay for their "friends" who all turn out to be a group of multis/cheaters. This is the first time, and since it was my mistake to trust buny with this, I paid for the 4500 admin fee out of my pocket to refund 3 people in question.
I had an argument about it with DEATHisNEAR about how I have a letter that proves that buny paid for their entrances, but I asked her to send the 10k to them instead if the 30% rule allowed it. Hers did, but theirs did not. If I had not been so busy I would of had time to check each one anyway...but because she was already a member...I did not think she would try to hurt us this way by opening our doors to her "good friend" cheats. But rather than have problems down the road, I'll just pay for it.
Lesson learned. From now on even good friends of existing LoS members will be scrutinized as complete strangers. It is a shame, but this tends to happen out in the real world too. When a handshake was enough to do business...now 30 page contracts are required. | I apologize, Limustudotcom and DEATHisNEAR, for all this trouble. I am very sorry that this caused so much paranoia among you.
Please note there were no intentions of bad behaviour when I paid the fee. I was just unaware of the finesse behind the 30%-rule.. Hence this topic.
And this one.. https://www.lordswm.com/forum_messages.php?tid=1877639
I also take cheating very seriously, and am not arguing the clan-rules. They should be enforced. I did not know that if a friend paid the fee this was illegal. (Also, and I know it's not a strong argument, but Buny's and/or Basion's past was unknown to me, and I trusted Buny because she is so explicit and active in keeping everything legal, for example her posts at the justice-branch of this forum).
I sincerely hope this can be sorted out. Ofcourse, shouting that I'm not a mult won't work, so I welcome every investigation. | | Thats funny i know a lot of people who have been kicked out of LoS because of transfers etc with buny and weren't refunded... "all 3" as stated in post 11 is seriously incorrect... | | Sorry for double post, but in message 14 i meant *legal* transfers...seeing as the troubles here are mainly about illegal ones i wouldn't want it to be confused.. | case still open, but question answered..
topic closed. | | closed by stoter (2010-03-17 00:18:48) |
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