| Author | Retaliation after Knockback? |
|---|
For example:
https://www.lordswm.com/war.php?lt=-1&warid=720179674
https://www.lordswm.com/war.php?lt=-1&warid=720184790
The target didn't move after successful Knockback, maybe that's why I got retaliation from it?
Was it always like that or it's new? Or it's a bug? |
if the target doesnt or cant move after a knockback, then yes you will recieve retal im afraid. as a fellow dwarf i dont like it either :D
but its allways been like it. |
If I saw correct from the first link, the target couldn't move backwards, he got knocked but not moved. Thats why he retaliated instead (but still knocked).
There was no space behind him to move towards. |
Yes you will still receive the retal after a knock back if the target doesn't move.
It's always been like this, but the unit still gets his turn knocked back. |
Thanks for clarification guys.
as a fellow dwarf i dont like it either :D
Actually this can be useful for using Rune of Crusade, because now I'll know how to make sure I'll get both attacks even if Knockback was successful (I mean when it's possible to make sure that the target won't move). |
| It's not new and it's not a bug. |
What Knockback does is:
- Make the targeted stack lose all its acumulated initiative.
- Move it backwards one tile.
The skill does not ignore the retal. When you knockback a stack,the enemy obviously cant retal because he is not next to your unit, not because the skill itselfs ignores retal, thus it retals if the enemy is not moved. |
| if you knock your enemy into obstacle or edge of battlefield or any other "wall" ,they will retaliate |
Yes, I understand it now, the official description is confusing (and actually wrong):
Knockback:
† Triggering special ability.
After every attack, this creature has a chance to knock the target by one tile at the direction of its attack. The target will not be able to retaliate after a successful knockback, as well as it will lose all of its accumulated initiative. Large creatures cannot be knocked. |
| Everyone has misunderstood the difference between Paw knock & Knockback |
First is Knock back. Used by Ogres.
This is what you'll are mistaking it with. Completely different ability.
Second is Paw knock. Used by Bears.
No confusion at all. Description to Paw Knock are crystal clear that Retaliation shall occur post Paw Knock if the target has not been displaced. |
Thank you AKA for clarification!
But in battle
https://www.lordswm.com/war.php?lt=-1&warid=720179674
you see this:
Frontier ursary perform knockback at Wardens.
Frontier ursary deal 436 damage to Wardens. 54 perish.
Wardens deal 29 damage to Frontier ursary. |
But in battle
https://www.lordswm.com/war.php?lt=-1&warid=720179674
you see this:
Frontier ursary perform knockback at Wardens.
Frontier ursary deal 436 damage to Wardens. 54 perish.
Wardens deal 29 damage to Frontier ursary.
If I saw correct from the first link, the target couldn't move backwards, he got knocked but not moved. Thats why he retaliated instead (but still knocked).
There was no space behind him to move towards. |
Bears attacked using rune of crusade.
In first strike, enemy got knocked by 1 tile.
Urasary then got luck and morale again and did not do any action.
Is that glitch?
https://www.lordswm.com/war.php?warid=720251832 |
But in battle
https://www.lordswm.com/war.php?lt=-1&warid=720179674
you see this:
Frontier ursary perform knockback at Wardens.
Frontier ursary deal 436 damage to Wardens. 54 perish.
Wardens deal 29 damage to Frontier ursary.
There are two stages in place during Paw Knock:
Stage 1. The Initiative Knock: Depends upon the distance traveled by Ursary, no relation with Retaliation.
Stage 2. The Ground Displacement: If there is a displacement, retaliation won't take place, if there isn't, retaliation will take place.
Bears attacked using rune of crusade.
In first strike, enemy got knocked by 1 tile.
Urasary then got luck and morale again and did not do any action.
Is that glitch?
https://www.lordswm.com/war.php?warid=720251832
Yes that's a glitch. :D |
| Can you explain why sometimes bears Paw Knock on retaliation ? |
Yes, I understand it now, the official description is confusing (and actually wrong):
Knockback:
† Triggering special ability.
After every attack, this creature has a chance to knock the target by one tile at the direction of its attack. The target will not be able to retaliate after a successful knockback, as well as it will lose all of its accumulated initiative. Large creatures cannot be knocked.
It says SUCCESSFUL knockback. You can argue that not moving the target backwards is not complete success.
Nothing wrong there. |
Can you explain why sometimes bears Paw Knock on retaliation?
Paw Knock is a Triggering Ability. As per which I quote:
If DHP >= THP, then
Probability = 25% + 3% * (DHP/THP);
else
Probability = 25% - 3% * (THP/DHP)
where:
» DHP is the total remaining HP of the damaging stack;
» THP is the total remaining HP of the target stack;
» Trigger probability lays within the interval of [5%;75%];
Thus trigger probability is always in positives given any situation, viz. 5%+
Given no displacement takes place on retaliation, yet there is a positive trigger probability, Paw Knock can occur on retaliation. |
My point in post #12 is this:
In combat I see this text:
Frontier ursary perform knockback at Wardens.
(So, it means that it was a successful knockback)
In official description I see this:
Paw knock:
† Triggering special ability.
Target creature can only retaliate if it has not been knocked.
(this part is wrong, because instead of "knocked" it should be "moved by a knockback" or something like that) |
for Lord Robai:
True. It leads to a confusion between both the types of knocking being applied, one on the ATB scale and one on the physical battlefield. |
