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| Author | Wizard faction topic |
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Warwick, i won first 2 or 3 battles again demon too, but other fights again demon i lose. If demon play good, you cannot win, trust me. Cave demon in one big stack, pit lords splited as much as possible. Each stack can summon another stacks + they will use disrupt and fireballs = too much damage.
279: I agree, that sphynx warrior is very nice unit, but i dont think, thah he is the best choise for wizard. In Homam is Sphynx very nice unit for wizard, because in Homam wizard can be strong in both physical attack and magic attack together and wizard can mass them. But in LWM wizard cannot be good in physical and magic attack together. For might wizard Sphynx is nice unit of course, but i dont think, that caster wizard will use them mainly for destroying enemy in physical attack. But still have nice amount of hp, so they could be good used for tanking or blocking archers. If i can change them for any other tier 6 unit, i would choose upgraded treefolk, what is the best type unit for LWM caster wizard. Amazing tank with imobilizing ability, must be wet dream for any caster :). | | 280: Recruit max magi, max gargs and rest of golems. Split magi as much as possible for max damage and use gargs as tank for buying time for your hero spells. | for Valgard:
I prefer max Gargs, then max Gols. Magi don't do much damage and going for Gols before Magi gives you more HP to withstand opponent attacks. | To Huntress,
Golems are slow, very slow. Max gargs with HP+Defence+Speed for max survivability. Even though Golems have more HP, it's not really useful because you can't run away. Just stand there and get pounded. | for Widowmaker88:
Please, read more carefully :) I have said: max Gargs, then max Gols
I said this because Valgard advised max magi, max gargs and rest of golems. | Valgard advised max magi, max gargs and rest of golems.
That's indeed the best way to recruit things at level 7. Normal golems are really bad - they are too slow and their hp is also not very good for a tier3 tank. The only level that you should consider recruiting more golems than magi is level 10-11 ( or 9 also if you buy modern ones with diamonds ) that you have to choose between modern golems and magi. Once lorekeepers are made - then golems can be safely dumped to oblivion along with their friends the gremlins :-) | Let's see. The data below is valid for level 7.
Option A:
Magi (11) - Gargs (55) - Gols (13) - Grems (2, but they are usually dumped to make a slot for splitting).
With +3 HP minis it makes up for 11*21+55*18+13*21=1494 HP. Magi are split 3-2-2-2-2 which makes up for 42+32+32+32+32=170 dmg.
Option B:
Gargs (55) - Golems (20) - Magi (7) - Grems (1, dumped as well).
With +3 HP minis it makes up for 18*55+20*21+7*21=1557 HP. Magi are split 2-2-1-1-1 which makes up for 32+32+20+20+20=124 dmg.
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So, you trade off 46 dmg (Magi rarely live for more than 1 turn) for 63 HP. I prefer this option, especially when completing MG quests.
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BTW, there is also Option C:
Grems (41) - Gargs (37) - Gols (17) - Magi (7)
It's 41*9+37*18+17*21+7*21=1539 HP.
You can defend with Grems as well as with Gargs, they have 11 Ini and ranged attack. Moreover, Grems can repair up to 164 HP for Golems, which should be taken into account.
At level 7, when you don't have Enchanted Gargs (no diamond ups here) and no triple minis (so, no HP+Defence+Speed), it's pretty viable. | | 46 damage? if you split magi to 5 stacks you can do well more than 100 damage on first turn - and in most cases some of those stacks will live to cast a second or a third round even. | for Jabbar:
Pleeeeease. Read my words:
Magi are split 3-2-2-2-2 which makes up for 42+32+32+32+32=170 dmg.
Magi are split 2-2-1-1-1 which makes up for 32+32+20+20+20=124 dmg.
I'm talking about damage DIFFERENCE here. | Sorry for double post
I wanted to say in more detail that if you have more magi it is a lot more possible that they will live to see 2nd turn rather than have less ones , thus it's a lot more than 46 damage difference usually.
There is also the issue of extra defense. The best mini art component you can add to magi in general is defense ( only vs spells hp is better but the vast majority of damage taken is physical ). With the extra base defense the magi pack they effectively absorb more damage than golems would. So you cannot just count the hps on every stack and value them equally :P HP on sphynx guardians are worth a LOT more than HP on gargoyles. | HP on sphynx guardians are worth a LOT more than HP on gargoyles.
Khm. I doubt it.
+3 HP to 4 or 5 Sphynx units versus +3 HP to 70-100 Gargs? The choice is simple :)
I know that you are much more knowledgable about wizsrds faction. I just want to show that there are different options, and chosing one is up to individual preferences.
BTW, I would like to discuss this part of your post in more details: The best mini art component you can add to magi in general is defense
Personally, I think that the most important component for Magi is Ini, not Defence. With Ini they have more chances to get their fisrt turn before Orcs/Elven bowmen/Druids/other shooters and even more chances to get their second turn faster, if they live to it. Defence comes second (for double minis) and HP - third (for triples). | HP on sphynx guardians are worth a LOT more than HP on gargoyles.
I am not talking about mini arts hp - i am talking about stack hp. What i mean is 600 hp of sphynx are worth a lot more than 600 hp of gargoyles because the sphynx will lose hit points a lot harder than gargoyles will.
Personally, I think that the most important component for Magi is Ini, not Defence. With Ini they have more chances to get their fisrt turn before Orcs/Elven bowmen/Druids/other shooters and even more chances to get their second turn faster, if they live to it. Defence comes second (for double minis) and HP - third (for triples).
Initiative is also good - probably best after defense. The problem with your theory about playing first is the might arts vs magic arts. The might arts give a lot of initiative and in the average case even with init mini artifact - if you are a spellcaster your magi will not play first. Maybe for min AP battles initiative mini art can work but for other battles and especially on higher levels you won't really have a decent chance to play first. In most cases I would consider morale better than initiative on magi - if they survive the first turn and do morale then they can play twice before enemy shooter. | Huntress:
Now think about, in what situation we need regruit golems over the magi.
In pve (hunts, mercenary) are 3 types of NPC (close combat units, ranged units and casters units).
If you are fighting against close combat units, your golems cannot do anything, until opponent come closer and then they can attack, but usually opponents number is so high, that attack is not recommended. Magi can shoot them or use magic punch and lower their number, until they come closer. Then still can make meat shield like golems, but golems will stay against highier number of units.
If you are fighting against ranged units, good tactics is block them with your units and lower their number with spells. Golems fail here, because their low speed and initiative are not enough for that. Magi have usually their turn first then shooter, so they can lower their number with magic punch, or shoot. Their speed is the same like golems, but with highier initiative can reach and block shooter much better.
And at last, caster units. Here can be golems better (thanks to 50 % magic resist), but battles against caster units are not very common and magi still can lower their number before they will cast and final result is almost the same.
For pvp are magi definitely much better than golems. Magi very often go first then orcs, elven bowmen and other dangerous enemy units and their damage is very high on low levels compared to other units. So magi can lower number of enemy units and "save" hit poit of your army when you will take damage. And magi can remove buffs and debuffs, what is very often used ability on pvp. Golems cannot do much in pvp. Maybe sometimes block any units. Their immune to delay and 50 % magic shield ability are useless, because no one little skilled will waste mana on them.
And about damage. If you have 5 stack of magi, as Jabbar wrote, usually most of them can do damage in next turns too. How many damage can do golems ? If you have magi, NPC will go for them first. After magi NPC wil go for golems and at last for gargs. Magi can do before they are dead a lot more damage than golems. | BTW, if anyone is interested, here are all possible MAX recruitments for levels 3-7:
Lvl 3:
Gremlins______Gargoyles______Golems
___26_____________22___________11__
___26_____________11___________16__
____2_____________32___________13__
____9_____________32___________11__
____1_____________26___________16__
Lvl 4:
Gremlins______Gargoyles______Golems
___26_____________24___________11__
___26_____________13___________16__
____0_____________35___________13__
____7_____________35___________11__
____0_____________29___________16__
Lvl 5:
Gremlins______Gargoyles______Golems______Magi
___26_____________24___________11__________5_
___26_____________24____________7__________7_
___26_____________14___________16__________5_
___26______________6___________16__________7_
____7_____________35___________11__________5_
____7_____________35____________7__________7_
____1_____________35___________13__________5_
____2_____________35____________9__________7_
____1_____________29___________16__________5_
____0_____________21___________16__________7_
Lvl 6:
Gremlins______Gargoyles______Golems______Magi
___30_____________26___________12__________5_
___30_____________26____________7__________8_
___30_____________15___________18__________5_
___30______________4___________18__________8_
____9_____________39___________12__________5_
____9_____________39____________7__________8_
____0_____________39___________15__________5_
____0_____________39___________10__________8_
____0_____________33___________18__________5_
____1_____________22___________18__________8_
Lvl 7:
Gremlins______Gargoyles______Golems______Magi
___41_____________37___________17__________7_
___41_____________37___________10_________11_
___41_____________19___________26__________7_
___41______________4___________26_________11_
___10_____________55___________17__________7_
___10_____________55___________10_________11_
____1_____________55___________20__________7_
____2_____________55___________13_________11_
____0_____________43___________26__________7_
____1_____________28___________26_________11_
If you have info for recruitment options for levels 1 and 2, please, PM them to me. | A few more details regarding initiative mini art issue on magi:
Magi start on 10 init as most shooters. For PvM with faction init bonus and mini art you can have them play first in the majority of cases ( not always since there is 10% variation on 1st turn ).
For PvP thought things are different ( this includes ambush vs caravans ). At level 7 - opponent will have SoM = 3% initiative at least. The main opponent shooters you get at that level is succubus, orc, bowman and druid. I will not discuss skeleton bowmen because at level 7 if you know what you are doing necros are a free frag anyway in full arts battle.
Succubus maybe you can play before. Most demons don't use other init boosting items than SoM at that level and with a 5% init mini art you can probably play before them ( with bigger chance anyway ).
Elf has 3% racial initiative and most good elves at that level will be using 1 ring of abdication at least if not two. With SoM and racial bonus thats 11% initiative that you don't have, which means stacks of druids or bowmen will play before your magi. Elf is probably the only opponent where HP mini art is better than defense because 1 druid cannot kill 1 magi with lightning.
Orc starts with 11 initiative, if he uses SoM you virtually have no chance to play before it.
On higher levels with 4% init from might rings and 3% more from amulet chances become even lower to play first in pvp.
With all these things considered i would go with def/init mini art on wizard for PvM on level 7 or so. For PvP defense with either morale or HP seem a far superior choice.
On higher levels - that you can do triples, you should just combine more of those effects without ever taking out defense. | Sorry for double post again but the above pvp observations are meant with full arts in battle. In min AP battles you can rely on init mini-arts to play first quite a bit.
In general - choosing the correct mini art for magi is probably the most troubling :-) | | It is totally luck dependant against (e)fks. As long as they do not get overly much morale you will survive but things can turn ugly fast if they get repeated morale which is frustrating. | How is calculated magic damage in hunts with enchants buff for spells?
Let's say that I have 10% enchant bonus to lightning, dealing 100 base damage, and that I have 2 faction level (wich means +100% to spell).
Will the final damage be 100 * 1.1 * 2 = 220 ? | | 298: yes | hello,
I just turned lvl 6 and I was wondering,
how come people say mana recovery is better than concealed knowledge but isnt it the opposite? with 3 knowledge, i get 10 shots in a row with CK but with MR, i have to get 7 and i have to wait wait wait....and wait until i get my 4 mana points again.
Is the problem becuase i have 3 knowledge and i should get 4 (by getting the hat) because i thought that getting more spell power would be better. When I was lvl 5, i didnt need more than 32 mana(mostly) so i didnt get knowledge in lvl 6. Now i almost have 6 sp with 3 knowledge. should i get 5sp with 4 and MR for talent?
thanks in advance |
This topic is long since last update and considered obsolete for further discussions.
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